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	<title>Comments on: Figuring out Chinese: Finding out about “何”</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/</link>
	<description>Japanese, Chinese, and a dash of Korean</description>
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		<title>By: Manucode</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-6773</link>
		<dc:creator>Manucode</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:28:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-6773</guid>
		<description>”何“ is an expression inherited from classical Chinese. refer to this Japanese 漢文入門 for its use as a question word.
http://www.seiwatei.net/kanbun/index.cgi?htm=gimon

Classical Chinese and modern standard mandarin are completely different (grammar, use of words, or even characters in some regions). ppl sometimes use some words or phrases in classical Chinese to emphasis or to sound polite or formal,  rarely more than one or two words.

in 意欲何为, 为 is a verb, read in the 2nd tone. 为 in Classical Chinese is a much more complicated word than “何”， which is simply questioning.

In China, mandarin in various regions are &quot;localized&quot; a lot, and some expressions are only understandable in certain regions.  i think it is better to study formally written articles like reports from Xinhua News Agents ( i give 100 for their language, 0 for their contents) it you want to understand the &quot;grammar&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>”何“ is an expression inherited from classical Chinese. refer to this Japanese 漢文入門 for its use as a question word.<br />
<a href="http://www.seiwatei.net/kanbun/index.cgi?htm=gimon" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.seiwatei.net/kanbun/index.cgi?htm=gimon&amp;referer=');">http://www.seiwatei.net/kanbun/index.cgi?htm=gimon</a></p>
<p>Classical Chinese and modern standard mandarin are completely different (grammar, use of words, or even characters in some regions). ppl sometimes use some words or phrases in classical Chinese to emphasis or to sound polite or formal,  rarely more than one or two words.</p>
<p>in 意欲何为, 为 is a verb, read in the 2nd tone. 为 in Classical Chinese is a much more complicated word than “何”， which is simply questioning.</p>
<p>In China, mandarin in various regions are &#8220;localized&#8221; a lot, and some expressions are only understandable in certain regions.  i think it is better to study formally written articles like reports from Xinhua News Agents ( i give 100 for their language, 0 for their contents) it you want to understand the &#8220;grammar&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Nick</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-6596</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Oct 2009 22:15:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-6596</guid>
		<description>One of the hard parts of Chinese is figuring out when a usage you see is a classical or idiomatic usage, and furthermore the register at which a word or expression is used. Once you pass a certain level in Chinese, where the grammar makes sense, and the ways that Chinese abbreviates high-level grammar, for lack of a better term, things get less opaque. But until you figure all these things out, it&#039;s very difficult to look at a word and know how abbreviated or literary it is.

So, 何. In Classical Chinese, this word meant &quot;what, or how.&quot; (Note that, as a previous poster alluded to, as &quot;Classical&quot; Chinese was used for almost 2000 years, I use the term very loosely here.) In Classical, its syntax is a bit strange, but the only point you need to know is relating to 为何.  为 in classical meant ten million things, but the most common were &quot;for,&quot; &quot;to do, &quot;to be.&quot; These and other meanings are all context-based, it sucks, etc...basically, be glad you&#039;re in Modern land. The reason 为何 ofter means &quot;why&quot; is because it can be analyzed as &quot;for what.&quot; But it can also mean &quot;do what,&quot; or &quot;be what.&quot; Context is hard. These examples you&#039;ve found are literary and archaic-feeling, and thus don&#039;t analyze very simply as their meanings are often ossified in the specific usage or saying in which they occur. You will learn to differentiate these examples with time, but it does take time.

And it can also be written 何为. Essentially, they don&#039;t have a general difference in meaning. (I can explain it with classical syntax but I don&#039;t want to get too arcane here.) The more common classical usage is 何为, but luckily, the difference doesn&#039;t matter to you :)

So how can you go about looking at these things? Chinese can actually, sometimes, be broken down by individual character meanings, but in order to do that, you need to know or be able to find the individual meanings. In this case, a dictionary might not actually help you, as the modern language doesn&#039;t always work on an individual-character level. (Interestingly, as Japanese uses many classical meanings for characters, you may be able to cross-reference with the Japanese meaning of individual characters. As modern Chinese words are mostly binomial, this is harder to pin down from only the modern language.) K wrote that English translations are not always helpful for understanding Chinese, and this is often true. As others have said, the best way to proceed is to atomize meaning, as you have been doing. Example of such atomizing? Your old friend 何止. Kevin says &quot;not only,&quot; and he&#039;s right, but you can analyze it more simply, and more helpfully: &quot;why stop (at),&quot; with a rhetorical-question flavor. Ta-da. Maybe Chinese does make some sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the hard parts of Chinese is figuring out when a usage you see is a classical or idiomatic usage, and furthermore the register at which a word or expression is used. Once you pass a certain level in Chinese, where the grammar makes sense, and the ways that Chinese abbreviates high-level grammar, for lack of a better term, things get less opaque. But until you figure all these things out, it&#8217;s very difficult to look at a word and know how abbreviated or literary it is.</p>
<p>So, 何. In Classical Chinese, this word meant &#8220;what, or how.&#8221; (Note that, as a previous poster alluded to, as &#8220;Classical&#8221; Chinese was used for almost 2000 years, I use the term very loosely here.) In Classical, its syntax is a bit strange, but the only point you need to know is relating to 为何.  为 in classical meant ten million things, but the most common were &#8220;for,&#8221; &#8220;to do, &#8220;to be.&#8221; These and other meanings are all context-based, it sucks, etc&#8230;basically, be glad you&#8217;re in Modern land. The reason 为何 ofter means &#8220;why&#8221; is because it can be analyzed as &#8220;for what.&#8221; But it can also mean &#8220;do what,&#8221; or &#8220;be what.&#8221; Context is hard. These examples you&#8217;ve found are literary and archaic-feeling, and thus don&#8217;t analyze very simply as their meanings are often ossified in the specific usage or saying in which they occur. You will learn to differentiate these examples with time, but it does take time.</p>
<p>And it can also be written 何为. Essentially, they don&#8217;t have a general difference in meaning. (I can explain it with classical syntax but I don&#8217;t want to get too arcane here.) The more common classical usage is 何为, but luckily, the difference doesn&#8217;t matter to you <img src='http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>So how can you go about looking at these things? Chinese can actually, sometimes, be broken down by individual character meanings, but in order to do that, you need to know or be able to find the individual meanings. In this case, a dictionary might not actually help you, as the modern language doesn&#8217;t always work on an individual-character level. (Interestingly, as Japanese uses many classical meanings for characters, you may be able to cross-reference with the Japanese meaning of individual characters. As modern Chinese words are mostly binomial, this is harder to pin down from only the modern language.) K wrote that English translations are not always helpful for understanding Chinese, and this is often true. As others have said, the best way to proceed is to atomize meaning, as you have been doing. Example of such atomizing? Your old friend 何止. Kevin says &#8220;not only,&#8221; and he&#8217;s right, but you can analyze it more simply, and more helpfully: &#8220;why stop (at),&#8221; with a rhetorical-question flavor. Ta-da. Maybe Chinese does make some sense.</p>
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		<title>By: kevin</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-5522</link>
		<dc:creator>kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Aug 2009 11:09:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-5522</guid>
		<description>何为感觉？  何 translates as &quot;What&quot;.     为 means &quot;is&quot;,   感觉 mean &quot;feeling&quot;
何为爱？ translate as “what is love”
Here is a piece of a classic chinese poem
问世间情为何物，直教人生死相许.     何 also translated  as &quot;what&quot; in here. 
What we know about the true love in this world is the life to a life promise only!


1. 你这次考试的结果如何？
 
如何 translates as &quot;how&quot; in English.   If you breaks down 如何， it would become  &quot;如“ and ”何“。   In chinese，&quot;如” has many differnt meanings， but in this word it means &quot;like&quot; in English，  and “何” still means “what” in English。

如何 can be direct translated as “like what？”
1. 你这次考试的结果如何？
so， this sentence can be translated as :
how is the result of your exam (like) ? 


1. 他为何不来？ 
In this sentence,  为 means “for” in english.    何 still means “what”
为何 --&gt; for what   or   (why)
Why he is not coming?        (English and Chinese is very similar in grammer)

 2. 你有何高见.           何 mean what。
   what opinion do you have?


何止一桌，是一个公司！
In this sentence,  何止 means “not only”。   This is a special case, but most of the time 何means “what”。


小泉三次参拜靖国神社意欲何为？
 
意欲何为 is classic chinese.  It means (what is the intension? or just simplely means why)  It is not too hard to understand if you break it down into character by character.
意 ---&gt; 意图 means  &quot;intention&quot;
欲 ---&gt; means &quot;desire&quot;
何 ---&gt; means &quot;what&quot;
为 ----&gt; means &quot;for&quot;
...............................
上大学有何用.     何 means “what”。  用 means ”the use“
directly translation would be：
what is the uses for going college？ （why going to college？）

Conclusion, 何often means ”what“， but in the special case， ”何止“， 何 means ”Not”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>何为感觉？  何 translates as &#8220;What&#8221;.     为 means &#8220;is&#8221;,   感觉 mean &#8220;feeling&#8221;<br />
何为爱？ translate as “what is love”<br />
Here is a piece of a classic chinese poem<br />
问世间情为何物，直教人生死相许.     何 also translated  as &#8220;what&#8221; in here.<br />
What we know about the true love in this world is the life to a life promise only!</p>
<p>1. 你这次考试的结果如何？</p>
<p>如何 translates as &#8220;how&#8221; in English.   If you breaks down 如何， it would become  &#8220;如“ and ”何“。   In chinese，&#8221;如” has many differnt meanings， but in this word it means &#8220;like&#8221; in English，  and “何” still means “what” in English。</p>
<p>如何 can be direct translated as “like what？”<br />
1. 你这次考试的结果如何？<br />
so， this sentence can be translated as :<br />
how is the result of your exam (like) ? </p>
<p>1. 他为何不来？<br />
In this sentence,  为 means “for” in english.    何 still means “what”<br />
为何 &#8211;&gt; for what   or   (why)<br />
Why he is not coming?        (English and Chinese is very similar in grammer)</p>
<p> 2. 你有何高见.           何 mean what。<br />
   what opinion do you have?</p>
<p>何止一桌，是一个公司！<br />
In this sentence,  何止 means “not only”。   This is a special case, but most of the time 何means “what”。</p>
<p>小泉三次参拜靖国神社意欲何为？</p>
<p>意欲何为 is classic chinese.  It means (what is the intension? or just simplely means why)  It is not too hard to understand if you break it down into character by character.<br />
意 &#8212;&gt; 意图 means  &#8220;intention&#8221;<br />
欲 &#8212;&gt; means &#8220;desire&#8221;<br />
何 &#8212;&gt; means &#8220;what&#8221;<br />
为 &#8212;-&gt; means &#8220;for&#8221;<br />
&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.<br />
上大学有何用.     何 means “what”。  用 means ”the use“<br />
directly translation would be：<br />
what is the uses for going college？ （why going to college？）</p>
<p>Conclusion, 何often means ”what“， but in the special case， ”何止“， 何 means ”Not”</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1423</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Aug 2008 18:37:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1423</guid>
		<description>@pctsh
Ok, I added a correction to the post. Your explanation fits the context of the original text. I&#039;m still a bit confused but decided leave it as is for now.

@THT
Thanks, that&#039;s a good tidbit to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@pctsh<br />
Ok, I added a correction to the post. Your explanation fits the context of the original text. I&#8217;m still a bit confused but decided leave it as is for now.</p>
<p>@THT<br />
Thanks, that&#8217;s a good tidbit to know.</p>
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		<title>By: THT</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1422</link>
		<dc:creator>THT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 10:32:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1422</guid>
		<description>Another phrase that is commonly used is ”何必“.
It is used when one is commenting on an action that is unnecessary given the circumstances.

Examples:
“早知今日,何必当初？”
(This one&#039;s a saying: Knowing the consequences that will occur now, why did you proceed with your actions (in the past) then?

“你何必这样做呢？”
(Is a necessary for you to do this?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another phrase that is commonly used is ”何必“.<br />
It is used when one is commenting on an action that is unnecessary given the circumstances.</p>
<p>Examples:<br />
“早知今日,何必当初？”<br />
(This one&#8217;s a saying: Knowing the consequences that will occur now, why did you proceed with your actions (in the past) then?</p>
<p>“你何必这样做呢？”<br />
(Is a necessary for you to do this?)</p>
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		<title>By: pctsh</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1420</link>
		<dc:creator>pctsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 01:41:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1420</guid>
		<description>Hi, this is my 1st reply on your blog.

The meaning for &quot;何为感觉&quot; is &quot;what is feeling&quot;, just like what safarinew explained, but i seldom heard or read this sentence because i think everybody know what is feeling, right?

If someone who never fall in love before ask &quot;何为爱的感觉?&quot; will make sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, this is my 1st reply on your blog.</p>
<p>The meaning for &#8220;何为感觉&#8221; is &#8220;what is feeling&#8221;, just like what safarinew explained, but i seldom heard or read this sentence because i think everybody know what is feeling, right?</p>
<p>If someone who never fall in love before ask &#8220;何为爱的感觉?&#8221; will make sense.</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1419</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2008 16:58:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1419</guid>
		<description>@K and safarinew

Thanks for the clarification!

Ok, so it sounds like 何为 and 为何 are pretty much the same and are more literary style of 为什么?

And so maybe 何为感觉 means something like &quot;why do we feel?&quot;, very philosophical indeed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@K and safarinew</p>
<p>Thanks for the clarification!</p>
<p>Ok, so it sounds like 何为 and 为何 are pretty much the same and are more literary style of 为什么?</p>
<p>And so maybe 何为感觉 means something like &#8220;why do we feel?&#8221;, very philosophical indeed.</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1418</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2008 16:25:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1418</guid>
		<description>ありがとう！

これは、多分辞書からコピーしたときのタイプミスだね。</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ありがとう！</p>
<p>これは、多分辞書からコピーしたときのタイプミスだね。</p>
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		<title>By: bubblebath</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1421</link>
		<dc:creator>bubblebath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2008 16:13:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1421</guid>
		<description>勝手に日本語直すマン参上！

あなたにはどんなをお考えがおありでしょうか？
　　　　　　　　　　　↓
あなたにはどんなお考えがおありでしょうか？

See ya!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>勝手に日本語直すマン参上！</p>
<p>あなたにはどんなをお考えがおありでしょうか？<br />
　　　　　　　　　　　↓<br />
あなたにはどんなお考えがおありでしょうか？</p>
<p>See ya!</p>
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		<title>By: safarinew</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/01/figuring-out-chinese-finding-out-about-%e2%80%9c%e4%bd%95%e2%80%9d/comment-page-1/#comment-1416</link>
		<dc:creator>safarinew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2008 09:21:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=247#comment-1416</guid>
		<description>wow, interesting
the comment above sums up quite well( are you Chinese?), that&#039;t abou it: &quot;何&quot; semms like just a question mark &quot;?&quot;, and it attaches a qestion to whatever near it.

specifically, &quot;何为&quot; generally mean &quot;what constitute&quot; &quot;how...works&quot;, so i guess your interpretation of &quot;what is the feeling for&quot; for &quot;何为感觉”is misled. i understand it should simplely be &quot;what IS FEELING?&quot;.Hmmm, sounds like a philosophical question..

and for the more archaic use &quot;意欲何为&quot;, things are different. as in CLASSIC CHINESE( though many usage of which still lingers), &quot;何为&quot; is in a reversed pattern as i understand. it is actually &quot;为何”, thus tranlates into &quot;干什么&quot;.

good for you, you didn&#039;t ask &quot;为”，this word seems like more flexible. but again, those nuances mainly exists in 文言文, now we use words such as 谁，什么，什么时候 more, as mentioned above.

yeah, what&#039;s the point anyway? i don&#039;t get it</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wow, interesting<br />
the comment above sums up quite well( are you Chinese?), that&#8217;t abou it: &#8220;何&#8221; semms like just a question mark &#8220;?&#8221;, and it attaches a qestion to whatever near it.</p>
<p>specifically, &#8220;何为&#8221; generally mean &#8220;what constitute&#8221; &#8220;how&#8230;works&#8221;, so i guess your interpretation of &#8220;what is the feeling for&#8221; for &#8220;何为感觉”is misled. i understand it should simplely be &#8220;what IS FEELING?&#8221;.Hmmm, sounds like a philosophical question..</p>
<p>and for the more archaic use &#8220;意欲何为&#8221;, things are different. as in CLASSIC CHINESE( though many usage of which still lingers), &#8220;何为&#8221; is in a reversed pattern as i understand. it is actually &#8220;为何”, thus tranlates into &#8220;干什么&#8221;.</p>
<p>good for you, you didn&#8217;t ask &#8220;为”，this word seems like more flexible. but again, those nuances mainly exists in 文言文, now we use words such as 谁，什么，什么时候 more, as mentioned above.</p>
<p>yeah, what&#8217;s the point anyway? i don&#8217;t get it</p>
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