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	<title>Comments on: Learner/Beginner Dictionaries: The Ultimate Oxymoron</title>
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	<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/</link>
	<description>Japanese, Chinese, and a dash of Korean</description>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-4831</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 21:31:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-4831</guid>
		<description>I have used such a device from Korea and it&#039;s horribly slow, the battery life a joke, the user-interface is atrocious, and it&#039;s bloated with features I don&#039;t need.

However, I have not tried that model. You should probably try both in the store and see which one you like better. I would be careful to note what kind of dictionaries are loaded to make sure they are comprehensive enough.

Personally, I like something that I don&#039;t have to worry about recharging (2 AAA&#039;s are good for years before I have to replace them) and I need it to be responsive and easy to use for the sole purpose of learning new words.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have used such a device from Korea and it&#8217;s horribly slow, the battery life a joke, the user-interface is atrocious, and it&#8217;s bloated with features I don&#8217;t need.</p>
<p>However, I have not tried that model. You should probably try both in the store and see which one you like better. I would be careful to note what kind of dictionaries are loaded to make sure they are comprehensive enough.</p>
<p>Personally, I like something that I don&#8217;t have to worry about recharging (2 AAA&#8217;s are good for years before I have to replace them) and I need it to be responsive and easy to use for the sole purpose of learning new words.</p>
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		<title>By: danJD</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-4759</link>
		<dc:creator>danJD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 10:18:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-4759</guid>
		<description>All these posts about the merits of particular electronic dictionaries have led me to wonder about (apparent) vast differences in quality considering the price.  I mean, for about $300-400 you can get a top-end (last year&#039;s model) Casio Ex-Word GP9700 or a Sharp RD-PM10.  The Casio model seems like the standard Denshi Jisho with the same ol&#039; back-lit B&amp;W LCD screen with pixelated fonts. Although it has a long battery life, it uses 2 AAA batteries, which for portable electronics these days is a bit 90&#039;s.  The Sharp model on the other hand, seems like a glorified PDA with a rechargeable battery, color screen, internet access, hard drive, MP3 player, etc, etc.  I know these crazy MID model dictionaries can be a bit distracting with all these extraneous features, but at least they use nice &#039;anti-aliased&#039; font types and intuitive UIs. It goes without saying that both models have competent handwritten Kanji recognition. 

So what does the Casio model have over the Sharp? I would guess that it has better search features, better dictionaries(?). But really I don&#039;t know, and for $400, I would want something pretty high quality (heck, an iPod Touch is about that much).

So what&#039;s the advantage? I would really like to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All these posts about the merits of particular electronic dictionaries have led me to wonder about (apparent) vast differences in quality considering the price.  I mean, for about $300-400 you can get a top-end (last year&#8217;s model) Casio Ex-Word GP9700 or a Sharp RD-PM10.  The Casio model seems like the standard Denshi Jisho with the same ol&#8217; back-lit B&amp;W LCD screen with pixelated fonts. Although it has a long battery life, it uses 2 AAA batteries, which for portable electronics these days is a bit 90&#8242;s.  The Sharp model on the other hand, seems like a glorified PDA with a rechargeable battery, color screen, internet access, hard drive, MP3 player, etc, etc.  I know these crazy MID model dictionaries can be a bit distracting with all these extraneous features, but at least they use nice &#8216;anti-aliased&#8217; font types and intuitive UIs. It goes without saying that both models have competent handwritten Kanji recognition. </p>
<p>So what does the Casio model have over the Sharp? I would guess that it has better search features, better dictionaries(?). But really I don&#8217;t know, and for $400, I would want something pretty high quality (heck, an iPod Touch is about that much).</p>
<p>So what&#8217;s the advantage? I would really like to know.</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1770</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Dec 2008 22:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1770</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I find that the real value of a learner’s dictionary is not using it as a reference work&lt;/blockquote&gt;

（ﾟ_ﾟ）I think that would surprise and annoy a lot of people who buy it exactly for that purpose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I find that the real value of a learner’s dictionary is not using it as a reference work</p></blockquote>
<p>（ﾟ_ﾟ）I think that would surprise and annoy a lot of people who buy it exactly for that purpose.</p>
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		<title>By: furrykef</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1769</link>
		<dc:creator>furrykef</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Dec 2008 18:50:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1769</guid>
		<description>I find that the real value of a learner&#039;s dictionary is not using it as a reference work, but rather as something to flip through and learn something new. Most people don&#039;t flip through dictionaries for fun, but I do on occasion, and my Oxford Beginner&#039;s Japanese Dictionary gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling when I flip through it. By contrast, a large dictionary is too likely to have a whole ton of stuff you don&#039;t need to know, especially in the early stages of learning a language. I mean, it&#039;s definitely good to have for reference, but it&#039;s not so good for flipping through unless you&#039;re interested in obscure words or usages. And I find flipping through an electronic or computer dictionary to be no fun at all.

- Kef</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find that the real value of a learner&#8217;s dictionary is not using it as a reference work, but rather as something to flip through and learn something new. Most people don&#8217;t flip through dictionaries for fun, but I do on occasion, and my Oxford Beginner&#8217;s Japanese Dictionary gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling when I flip through it. By contrast, a large dictionary is too likely to have a whole ton of stuff you don&#8217;t need to know, especially in the early stages of learning a language. I mean, it&#8217;s definitely good to have for reference, but it&#8217;s not so good for flipping through unless you&#8217;re interested in obscure words or usages. And I find flipping through an electronic or computer dictionary to be no fun at all.</p>
<p>- Kef</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1753</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 17:53:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1753</guid>
		<description>I assume by IPod, you mean IPod Touch, right? It would be difficult to use a dictionary with just a click wheel.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I assume by IPod, you mean IPod Touch, right? It would be difficult to use a dictionary with just a click wheel.</p>
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		<title>By: TerryS</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1751</link>
		<dc:creator>TerryS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 08:29:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1751</guid>
		<description>I have definitely found paper dictionaries are missing many entries. I also wish my first dictionary was *without* the romaji, since the last thing I am going to buy now is another dictionary (though I found a pretty good pocket dictionary). Unfortunately, it takes learning some Japanese before you realize that there even *is* a kana, and that romaji is a crutch.

As for hand-holding with the kana, that is a major annoyance and one reason it is hard to find appropriate beginner texts. Learning the kana is *super-easy* and you do not need a workbook for it -- all you need is a chart, some rules on pronunciation, and a sheet of paper. You can learn them quickly all on your own.

One thing about the Random House dictionary, though, is it has very good examples.

Online dictionaries are wonderful, if not perfect. I like Denshi Jisho ( http://www.jisho.org ) because its search functions are great and a kanji entry is enlarged merely by hovering over it with your mouse. However, it often returns a lot of unmatching examples, and the &quot;show all&quot; link doesn&#039;t work -- you have to navigate each page of results manually.

My favorite kanji and word lookup mehtod is &quot;Moji&quot; (Firefox extension, because you can just highlight a word and hit &quot;Alt+K&quot; or &quot;Alt+W&quot;.

I considered getting an electronic dictionary (and I partly still wish I did), but I decided on an iPod in the end for the ability to listen to audio lessons.

I also found a kanji dictionary for iPod, called &quot;Kotoba&quot;, on iTunes for free. Though one gripe is figuring out how to use the limited screen keys to tyep *any* hiragana is confusing, and it&#039;s actually missing き! The only way around this is to enter your word without the き (for example, if it&#039;s an i-adjective, use another form), then follow with another word that will auto-complete including き, then backspace over everything in between. Well, that&#039;s what you get for free, sometimes.

Anyone have a better suggestion for an iPod dictionary?

I did spend a large chunk of time in the iStore, but that stuff is bottomless! If I could search directly for a particular app, that would be great!

*Note: I do not have wi-fi or iPhone* -- this has to be a stand-alone app that does not have to connect to the Internet. My iPod is only connected when docked on my computer, and if that&#039;s the case, I&#039;m using the computer for something else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have definitely found paper dictionaries are missing many entries. I also wish my first dictionary was *without* the romaji, since the last thing I am going to buy now is another dictionary (though I found a pretty good pocket dictionary). Unfortunately, it takes learning some Japanese before you realize that there even *is* a kana, and that romaji is a crutch.</p>
<p>As for hand-holding with the kana, that is a major annoyance and one reason it is hard to find appropriate beginner texts. Learning the kana is *super-easy* and you do not need a workbook for it &#8212; all you need is a chart, some rules on pronunciation, and a sheet of paper. You can learn them quickly all on your own.</p>
<p>One thing about the Random House dictionary, though, is it has very good examples.</p>
<p>Online dictionaries are wonderful, if not perfect. I like Denshi Jisho ( <a href="http://www.jisho.org" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.jisho.org?referer=');">http://www.jisho.org</a> ) because its search functions are great and a kanji entry is enlarged merely by hovering over it with your mouse. However, it often returns a lot of unmatching examples, and the &#8220;show all&#8221; link doesn&#8217;t work &#8212; you have to navigate each page of results manually.</p>
<p>My favorite kanji and word lookup mehtod is &#8220;Moji&#8221; (Firefox extension, because you can just highlight a word and hit &#8220;Alt+K&#8221; or &#8220;Alt+W&#8221;.</p>
<p>I considered getting an electronic dictionary (and I partly still wish I did), but I decided on an iPod in the end for the ability to listen to audio lessons.</p>
<p>I also found a kanji dictionary for iPod, called &#8220;Kotoba&#8221;, on iTunes for free. Though one gripe is figuring out how to use the limited screen keys to tyep *any* hiragana is confusing, and it&#8217;s actually missing き! The only way around this is to enter your word without the き (for example, if it&#8217;s an i-adjective, use another form), then follow with another word that will auto-complete including き, then backspace over everything in between. Well, that&#8217;s what you get for free, sometimes.</p>
<p>Anyone have a better suggestion for an iPod dictionary?</p>
<p>I did spend a large chunk of time in the iStore, but that stuff is bottomless! If I could search directly for a particular app, that would be great!</p>
<p>*Note: I do not have wi-fi or iPhone* &#8212; this has to be a stand-alone app that does not have to connect to the Internet. My iPod is only connected when docked on my computer, and if that&#8217;s the case, I&#8217;m using the computer for something else.</p>
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		<title>By: Florian</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1593</link>
		<dc:creator>Florian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Oct 2008 15:44:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1593</guid>
		<description>A bit more about the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary. I actually have a (slightly old) sharp electronic dictionary. It has the two geniuses and the 広辞苑 and a kanji dictionary. I look it up first, because it is more convienent. But I pretty often get frustrated with it, because even though coverage is great, explanations are not, and I am often left wondering what some kanji really mean, and the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary is usually very good at clearing things up.

The main problem is that being writen for Japanese people, electronic dictionaries will focus on explaining you the difference between english words, but when one english word can be translated in to several Japanese ones, they are not always that fantastic at telling you the difference.

But I think I have solved this issue. I am probably going to get myself one of the newer Casio electronic dictionaries, because they seem good, AND they have the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary as an add-on.

On the topic of French dictionaries, most electronic dictionaries include the exact same one as most people would be getting in paper version (petit royal), and they are not really great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A bit more about the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary. I actually have a (slightly old) sharp electronic dictionary. It has the two geniuses and the 広辞苑 and a kanji dictionary. I look it up first, because it is more convienent. But I pretty often get frustrated with it, because even though coverage is great, explanations are not, and I am often left wondering what some kanji really mean, and the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary is usually very good at clearing things up.</p>
<p>The main problem is that being writen for Japanese people, electronic dictionaries will focus on explaining you the difference between english words, but when one english word can be translated in to several Japanese ones, they are not always that fantastic at telling you the difference.</p>
<p>But I think I have solved this issue. I am probably going to get myself one of the newer Casio electronic dictionaries, because they seem good, AND they have the Kodansha’s Kanji dictionary as an add-on.</p>
<p>On the topic of French dictionaries, most electronic dictionaries include the exact same one as most people would be getting in paper version (petit royal), and they are not really great.</p>
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		<title>By: Moss</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1592</link>
		<dc:creator>Moss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 11:58:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1592</guid>
		<description>Yes, I definitely agree that Japanese electronic dictionaries are far superior learning tools.  I recently picked up the Casio Ex-word Dataplus 4.  Besides features mentioned earlier, it&#039;s got quizzes for the 漢字検定, 四字熟語辞典、and something I really like is that you can download plain text files into it.  So I head on over to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.aozora.gr.jp/index.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;青空文庫&lt;/a&gt; and pump it full of stories.  Then while you&#039;re reading the text on it, if you don&#039;t know a word, you can jump right to any of the dictionaries.  とても便利だよ。</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I definitely agree that Japanese electronic dictionaries are far superior learning tools.  I recently picked up the Casio Ex-word Dataplus 4.  Besides features mentioned earlier, it&#8217;s got quizzes for the 漢字検定, 四字熟語辞典、and something I really like is that you can download plain text files into it.  So I head on over to <a href="http://www.aozora.gr.jp/index.html" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.aozora.gr.jp/index.html?referer=');">青空文庫</a> and pump it full of stories.  Then while you&#8217;re reading the text on it, if you don&#8217;t know a word, you can jump right to any of the dictionaries.  とても便利だよ。</p>
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		<title>By: pOLAK</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1591</link>
		<dc:creator>pOLAK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:04:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1591</guid>
		<description>HI!
I AM FROM POLAND
YOU MAY NOT LIKE BOOKS
BUT YOU ARE AMERICAN!!!
OR JAPANESE!!!
I AM FROM POLAND AND I WOULD NEVER SAY THAT BOOK IS WASTING MONEY, BECAUSE THEY ARE CHEAP!
HEHEHE</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HI!<br />
I AM FROM POLAND<br />
YOU MAY NOT LIKE BOOKS<br />
BUT YOU ARE AMERICAN!!!<br />
OR JAPANESE!!!<br />
I AM FROM POLAND AND I WOULD NEVER SAY THAT BOOK IS WASTING MONEY, BECAUSE THEY ARE CHEAP!<br />
HEHEHE</p>
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		<title>By: taekk</title>
		<link>http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/2008/08/22/learner-dictionaries-the-ultimate-oxymoron/comment-page-1/#comment-1590</link>
		<dc:creator>taekk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:56:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.guidetojapanese.org/blog/?p=322#comment-1590</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know of any. See why the Asians get it so good? I would suggest learn Japanese first, then you can use the J&lt;-&gt;K dictionaries but maybe that&#039;s not very practical.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know of any. See why the Asians get it so good? I would suggest learn Japanese first, then you can use the J< ->K dictionaries but maybe that&#8217;s not very practical.</p>
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