{"id":77,"date":"2005-12-27T13:19:42","date_gmt":"2005-12-27T04:19:42","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/nihongo.3yen.com\/2005-12-27\/the-subtler-points-of\/"},"modified":"2013-07-30T14:45:53","modified_gmt":"2013-07-30T19:45:53","slug":"the-subtler-points-of","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/2005\/12\/27\/the-subtler-points-of\/","title":{"rendered":"The subtler points of \u300c\u4ee5\u300d"},"content":{"rendered":"

\u300c\u4ee5<\/a>\u300d \uff08not to be confused with \u300c\u4f3c<\/a>\u300d\uff09is a very useful character used in all sorts of words that compare time, space, or objects such as \u4ee5\u6765\u3001\u4ee5\u964d\u3001\u4ee5\u4e0a\u3001\u4ee5\u4e0b\u3001\u4ee5\u5916\u3001\u4ee5\u5185\u3001\u4ee5\u5f8c\u3001and \u4ee5\u524d . In all these words, the \u300c\u4ee5\u300d essentially means “besides” and the second character indicates what to compare.<\/p>\n

For instance, \u300c\u4ee5\u5916\u300d\uff08\u3044\u304c\u3044\uff09 uses the \u300c\u5916\u300d character for outside so it is describing anything outside of the thing we are comparing to.<\/p>\n

\u7530\u4e2d\u3055\u3093\u4ee5\u5916<\/u>\u306b\u3001\u884c\u304f\u4eba\u306f\u3044\u308b\uff1f
\n– Is there person going, outside of Tanaka-san? (Is anybody going besides Tanaka-san?)<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Notice how there is no particle between \u300c\u7530\u4e2d\u3055\u3093\u300d and \u300c\u4ee5\u5916\u300d. While it is possible to insert \u300c\u306e\u300d in between, in practice, it is more natural to directly attach the word to the end of the noun that is being compared. This applies to all the \u300c\u4ee5\u300d words given above.<\/p>\n

\u300c\u4ee5\u300d is an inclusive comparator<\/h2>\n

I think it’s important to mention that \u300c\u4ee5\u300d means “besides [x]”, therefore, the thing that is being compared to ([x] in this case) is included in the comparison. For example, if we say \u300c\u4e09\u3064\u4ee5\u4e0a\u300d, this means “three or more” and not<\/i> “more than three”. Or when we say, \u300c\u660e\u65e5\u4ee5\u964d\u300d this means “tomorrow or afterwards” not<\/i> “after tomorrow”.<\/p>\n

\u30ab\u30fc\u30c9\u30922\u679a\u4ee5\u4e0a<\/u>\u9078\u3093\u3067\u304f\u3060\u3055\u3044\u3002
\n– Please select 2 or more<\/u> cards.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

In English, words for comparisons such as “more” and “less” implicitly exclude the thing that is being compared. People who are used to the English way of doing things need to make sure whether they need to do a little adding or subtracting before using any of the words covered here. For instance, if I wanted to say, “less than three”, I might change this to \u300c\u4e8c\u3064\u4ee5\u4e0b\u300d or use some other expression such as \u300c\u672a\u6e80\u300d. Unfortunately, these comparators are not really systematic and it becomes a matter of learning vocabulary and learning when to use them based on practice.<\/p>\n

10\u6b73\u672a\u6e80\u306e\u304a\u5b50\u69d8\u306f\u4e57\u308c\u307e\u305b\u3093\u3002
\n– Children under 10 cannot go on the ride.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Here are other ways you might want to say “more than<\/a>” and “less than<\/a>“. Unfortunately, you can already see an inaccurate translation of \u300c\u4ee5\u4e0a\u300d.<\/p>\n

Sometimes, it might not be necessary to be that picky, but you should be aware of the difference for the times when it really does matter.<\/p>\n

Finally, to prove I’m not lying, here is a similar page<\/a> that explains the difference from a Japanese point of view.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

\u300c\u4ee5\u300d \uff08not to be confused with \u300c\u4f3c\u300d\uff09is a very useful character used in all sorts of words that compare time, space, or objects such as \u4ee5\u6765\u3001\u4ee5\u964d\u3001\u4ee5\u4e0a\u3001\u4ee5\u4e0b\u3001\u4ee5\u5916\u3001\u4ee5\u5185\u3001\u4ee5\u5f8c\u3001and \u4ee5\u524d . In all these words, the \u300c\u4ee5\u300d essentially means “besides” and the second … Continue reading →<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[9,10,11],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-77","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-grammar","category-intermediate","category-kanji"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/77","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=77"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/77\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=77"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=77"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.guidetojapanese.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=77"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}